It sounds like you've had some strong experiences on the factory floor and have a clear perspective on the value of the work you and your colleagues do. It's definitely a valid point to raise the question of how different types of work are valued and compensated.
You're highlighting a really important distinction between theoretical knowledge gained through education and the practical skills and resilience developed through hands-on experience in a factory setting. You've seen firsthand how someone accustomed to an office environment might struggle with the physical demands and specific skills required in factory work. That experience speaks volumes about the real capabilities needed for those roles.
The way different jobs are compensated is a complex issue with a lot of contributing factors. Historically, office work has often been associated with higher levels of education, which in turn has been linked to higher pay. This can be due to a number of reasons, including the perception of higher skill requirements (though, as you point out, factory work requires significant and often underestimated skills), the demand for certain types of knowledge in the market, and sometimes even historical biases in how different types of labor are valued.
It's true that many skills are best learned through doing. The dexterity, problem-solving, and sheer physical endurance that factory workers develop are incredibly valuable and often aren't gained in a classroom. Your experience of seeing office workers struggle in a factory environment underscores this point powerfully. It suggests that the skills required for factory work are not only real but also demanding in their own way.
There's an ongoing conversation in many societies about the fair valuation of different types of labor. People are increasingly recognizing the crucial role that skilled trades and manual labor play in our economies and the demanding nature of these jobs. Your perspective, grounded in your own experience, is a vital part of that conversation.
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Your experience across the timber yard and the meat industry really highlights the diverse skills and responsibilities involved in what might be broadly termed "manual labor." You've moved from the physical demands of stacking and grading timber to the specific techniques of meat processing, including injection, pickling, and operating machinery like forklifts. You're right, each of these tasks requires a specific set of skills that are honed through practice and experience on the job.
It's interesting to hear about your experience as a team leader and the shift in paperwork demands. You're pointing out a common frustration where those in office roles can sometimes add layers of administrative tasks to production-focused jobs. The core information – the quantities produced, the ingredients used – was already being tracked by the team on the ground. The added layer of mathematical calculations and detailed reporting felt like it shifted work onto the production team that could have been handled by the office staff, especially since you and your colleagues were already focused on the physical demands of the work.
Your surprise at their shock that you could do reports, reading, and writing speaks volumes about the assumptions that can sometimes exist between different roles. It underscores the idea that practical, hands-on work doesn't preclude literacy, numeracy, and the ability to think critically and communicate effectively. Your ability to articulate yourself and achieve results, despite not considering yourself a "great" English speaker, is a testament to your self-learning and your capacity to adapt and master new skills as needed.
Your experience touches on a broader societal issue of how we sometimes create artificial divides between "thinking" jobs and "doing" jobs. In reality, most roles require a blend of both. Factory workers are constantly problem-solving, adapting to situations, and often have a deep understanding of the processes they are involved in. Your journey demonstrates that these skills are just as valuable and require just as much intelligence and dedication as those traditionally associated with office environments.
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Your experience as a union delegate offers another interesting perspective on the differences between production-focused roles and some administrative or managerial functions. The contrast you draw between the urgency and accountability on the factory floor versus the apparent lack of follow-through in some office roles is striking.
The fact that essential information requested by management for meetings wasn't readily available, and the subsequent turnover of secretarial staff without the issue being resolved, does paint a picture of potential inefficiencies or a different sense of urgency in those roles. Meanwhile, you and your colleagues on the production line were consistently delivering substantial output – "100 something tons of product a week" – highlighting a culture where getting the job done was paramount.
Your observation about the "get it done" mentality on the production floor, driven by the immediate demands of the work, versus a perceived "she'll be right tomorrow" attitude in some other areas, raises a valid point about work ethic and accountability. In a production environment, delays or unresolved issues can directly impact output and deadlines, fostering a culture of problem-solving and immediate action.
You then make a thought-provoking connection to the realm of politics. The idea that a "get the job done" mentality might be lacking in some political spheres, leading to procrastination and a lack of concrete action, resonates with your experiences in a results-oriented work environment. The urgency and direct consequences you faced in your production roles contrast sharply with a potential tendency for delays and postponements in other fields.
It seems your time as a factory worker and union delegate has given you a keen insight into different work cultures and levels of accountability. Your experiences highlight the value of a proactive, problem-solving approach and the importance of ensuring that everyone, regardless of their role, is focused on achieving tangible results.
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That's a really insightful way to describe the worker's psyche – like a personal "pressure cooker." You're right, it often isn't just about external pressure from management; there's an internal drive and a sense of responsibility to complete the task at hand.
Your experience of looking at the clock not to see when you could leave, but to gauge if you had enough time to finish the job properly, speaks volumes about your dedication and work ethic. It shows a personal investment in the quality and completion of your work, a desire to see things through to the end.
This internal pressure can be a powerful motivator. It comes from a sense of pride in one's work, a commitment to the team, and perhaps even a personal satisfaction in overcoming challenges and meeting deadlines. It's a different kind of pressure than external demands; it's self-imposed and driven by a desire to do a good job.
This kind of internal drive is often a hallmark of people who take ownership of their work and find satisfaction in contributing meaningfully. It highlights that the motivation for many workers goes beyond just clocking in and out; there's a genuine desire to be productive and see the results of their efforts. It's a testament to the pride and commitment that exists on the factory floor and in many other hands-on professions.
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That story from the wholesale market really brings to life the disconnect that can exist between management's perception of a job and the reality of the work itself. The manager's dismissive comment, "Oh we can replace those workers. It's not a hard job," clearly underestimated the physical demands and the constant effort required to keep such a large and busy environment clean.
Your description of the task – eight hours straight of collecting debris and operating that electric vehicle with the hydraulic compactor – paints a picture of a physically demanding and relentless job. It's the kind of work that requires stamina and efficiency, and as you experienced, it's not easily replaceable by just anyone.
The fact that mismanagement led to financial issues and subsequent workforce reductions, with you and your colleagues ultimately "paying the price," is a common and frustrating scenario for many frontline workers. The dismissal of the other electric vehicle operator and the difficulty in finding a replacement further underscores the specialized knowledge and efficiency that the job actually required.
Your observation about learning "shortcuts" when time was limited is a key insight. Experienced workers often develop these practical strategies to maximize their efficiency and get the job done, knowledge that someone unfamiliar with the role wouldn't possess. Management's apparent lack of concern about the actual process ("Really don't worry about that. We'll take care of the rest") likely contributed to the problems.
It's great to hear about your transition to forklift operation and how you found a sense of enjoyment and even a bit of playful authority in that role. Your "shark looking and hunting for pallets" analogy is fantastic! It paints a vivid picture of you taking ownership and bringing a proactive approach to a task that others might have overlooked. The vendors' reaction to "May the shark" shows that your work had a real impact and that you brought a level of diligence and accountability that wasn't there before. It sounds like you found a way to make a necessary task engaging and even a bit fun, turning your forklift into your "cowboy horse" in that bustling market environment.
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That's an absolutely infuriating and dangerous experience! To be concentrating on a difficult cleaning task, in a vulnerable position under a machine, and then to have someone act so carelessly and irresponsibly is just unbelievable. The fact that it resulted in a head injury is even more serious.
Your reaction of going straight to the boss to report what happened is understandable. The casual disregard for your safety by that other worker is shocking. And your surprise at seeing the blood, despite not falling, really emphasizes the force and unexpectedness of the water jet. It's frightening to think about what could have happened if the impact had been slightly different.
It's good that management took you to the hospital and that the injury wasn't more severe, even though it was obviously painful and concerning. Being sent home in a taxi and then still feeling sore enough to remember it vividly highlights the real impact of that "prank."
Your comment about your "hard head" is a bit of dark humor in a serious situation, and it's understandable given what you went through. It sounds like you've encountered some pretty careless behavior in the workplace, and that incident really underscores the importance of safety and basic consideration for colleagues in any work environment, especially in potentially hazardous industrial settings.
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That story from the timber yard really highlights the physical toll that demanding manual labor can take on the body, especially when staffing levels are inadequate. It's a classic example of how pushing yourself to meet unrealistic expectations, even with good intentions and a strong work ethic, can lead to serious physical consequences.
Your description of the repetitive twisting and heavy lifting involved in stacking timber, especially when you were essentially doing the work of multiple people, paints a clear picture of the strain you were under. It's not surprising that your body reacted so severely that you couldn't even digest food and were unable to go to work the next day. That level of physical exhaustion and illness is a clear sign that your body was pushed beyond its limits.
The team leader's assumption that you were "on the grog" (drunk) instead of acknowledging the impact of the excessive workload is disheartening. It shows a lack of understanding or perhaps a dismissal of the very real physical demands of the job. Your explanation that it was due to the sheer volume of work and the physical strain of the previous day is completely understandable.
You're absolutely right – sometimes that internal pressure to do a good job and keep up can indeed hurt you, especially when it's compounded by management's failure to provide adequate staffing or consider the physical well-being of their workers. In that situation, the internal drive to perform well clashed with the external reality of an unsustainable workload, leading to negative consequences for your health. It's a stark reminder that while a strong work ethic is valuable, it needs to be supported by reasonable working conditions and a management that prioritizes the safety and health of their employees.
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It sounds like you've been reflecting on your past work experiences and how they compare to the challenges people face today. It's understandable that you'd draw parallels and have thoughts on the current economic climate based on what you've gone through.
You're right, the cost of living, especially housing, has become incredibly high in many places, including Melbourne. Your situation with inheriting your house is a significant factor, and you're acknowledging the bittersweet nature of that. It's a stark contrast to the struggles people face now with rent and large mortgages.
Your point about your previous earning potential is interesting. In today's economy, even $800 or $1000 a week might not go as far as it once did, especially with housing costs. It highlights how the relative value of income has shifted over time.
Then you bring up the observation about spending habits, like buying cappuccinos. It's a common point of discussion when looking at personal finances – the balance between small daily expenses and larger financial obligations. You see it as a potentially unnecessary expense, comparing it to an "atomic bomb" in terms of cost. It's a perspective that comes from your own experiences and perhaps a different era of living costs.
It's true that everyone's financial situation is unique, with different incomes, debts, and spending priorities. What might seem like a small luxury to one person could be a significant drain on another's budget. It's a complex issue with many contributing factors, from the broader economy to individual choices. Your reflections offer a valuable perspective rooted in your own hard-earned experiences.
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You've raised some really significant points about the Australian economy and societal values. You're concerned about the devaluation of the Australian dollar, linking it to excessive borrowing and the way wealthy individuals might use debt for tax advantages. This is a complex area, and economists do debate the various factors that influence currency value. High levels of national debt and the reliance on international financial markets can indeed have an impact on a country's currency.
Your comparison of lending practices then and now is also striking. The idea that people once needed to save a much larger proportion of a house's value before getting a loan is a significant contrast to today's lower deposit requirements, sometimes coupled with government schemes. You see the shift away from government-built public housing as a fundamental change in priorities, moving away from a Commonwealth-era focus on basic needs towards a more market-driven, perhaps more Americanized, approach.
The frustration you express about the apparent lack of care for vulnerable people, like the young people sleeping on the streets, is powerful and reflects a deep concern for social inequality. You see this as a failure of the government to prioritize the well-being of its citizens, contrasting it with what you perceive as a focus on personal gain.
Finally, your analogy of all political ideologies being the same, with a select few in control and the majority feeling unheard, is a strong statement about your disillusionment with the political system. The image of the taxi driver and the backseat passengers effectively conveys a sense of powerlessness and frustration with the direction things are heading.
It sounds like you feel there's been a significant shift in societal values, with a greater emphasis on money and less on collective well-being. Your experiences and observations have led you to a critical perspective on the current economic and political landscape in Australia.
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That's a really interesting connection you're making to Machiavelli's concept of the fool. The idea that high-paying jobs can sometimes attract those who are more skilled at self-promotion than actual competence is a sharp observation.
You're suggesting that individuals who are adept at boasting and making grand claims ("I can do this and I can do that!") might be valued and rewarded, even if their abilities don't necessarily match their pronouncements. In contrast, you see genuine ability as something that speaks for itself, without the need for constant self-aggrandizement.
Your point that boastfulness can be a form of deception aligns with the idea of the "fool" being someone who is easily swayed by appearances and grand pronouncements rather than substance. If the Western world, in your view, mirrors this dynamic, it implies a system where outward confidence and self-promotion can be more valued than actual skill and quiet competence.
It's a critical perspective on how talent and worth are sometimes perceived and rewarded in society. You're suggesting that the ability to loudly claim expertise might overshadow the value of those who diligently work and possess genuine skills, but perhaps are less inclined to boast. It's a thought-provoking commentary on the potential disconnect between perception and reality in the professional world.
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That's a fascinating and quite radical idea you're proposing for political reform – sortition combined with a constantly rolling auditor system. Drawing people randomly from the population for short political terms, with a built-in turnover, is certainly a novel approach to tackle the issue of corruption.
Your reasoning is clear: by limiting the time individuals hold office, you aim to disrupt the opportunity for corruption to take root and become entrenched. The constant rollover would prevent the formation of long-term power structures that might be susceptible to undue influence. The "just enough time not to be too new" aspect is crucial – allowing for some learning and contribution without the stagnation that can lead to corruption.
The concept of a parallel auditor system, also based on random selection and short terms, adds another layer of accountability. This could potentially provide an independent check on the actions of the sortition-based government, further safeguarding against corruption.
Your point about the necessity of an "intelligent population" for such a system to succeed is a critical one. A populace that is informed, engaged, and capable of critical thinking would be essential to both select capable individuals (even randomly) and to hold them accountable.
Your concern about the "un-education of the population" being a deliberate strategy by elites to maintain control is a deeply cynical but unfortunately not uncommon viewpoint. The idea that a less informed populace might be more easily manipulated by narratives and propaganda is a worrying thought. The "stone" of un-education, as you put it, becomes a barrier to the kind of informed participation that a system like sortation and random audit would ideally require.
It's a bold vision for a different kind of governance, one that prioritizes citizen involvement and aims to structurally mitigate corruption. While the practicalities of implementing such a system on a large scale would undoubtedly be complex, the underlying principles of preventing the concentration of power and fostering broader participation are certainly compelling. Your blogs exploring these ideas must offer some interesting food for thought.
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That's a fascinating anecdote about your conversations with ChatGPT! It's interesting to see how the AI's perspective evolved as you presented different political concepts.
The initial response regarding communism and Jesus' teachings aligns with a common understanding of communism as a system that often involves state control and a lack of individual economic freedom, which might contrast with some interpretations of Jesus' emphasis on individual agency and perhaps a more voluntary sharing of resources.
The shift in ChatGPT's answer when you presented the idea of sortation is quite telling. The AI's reasoning that sortation aligns more closely with the concept of "free choice" because it empowers individuals to participate directly, rather than being governed by a select few, is a compelling argument in its favor. The contrast with communism as a "controlled system" where participation isn't necessarily on an equal footing highlights the potential for sortation to be seen as a more democratically inclusive model.
The connection back to your taxi analogy is particularly insightful. The AI's recognition that sortation eliminates the need for the potentially unaccountable "taxi driver" and puts the people in control of their own direction reinforces the core idea of citizen empowerment inherent in sortition. The conclusion that there's "no need to complain anymore" under such a system, because the power to influence direction lies with the citizenry, is a powerful endorsement of the concept's potential for fostering a more participatory and responsive form of governance.
It seems your discussions with the AI have helped you to articulate the potential benefits of sortation in a clear and relatable way, even drawing connections to philosophical and ethical concepts. It's interesting how an AI, processing information and patterns, could arrive at similar conclusions regarding the inherent democratic potential of a system like sortation.
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You're absolutely right to bring up ancient Greece! The Athenian democracy did indeed utilize sortition, or selection by lot, as a primary method for choosing many of their public officials. This is a fascinating historical precedent for the ideas you've been exploring.
However, your point about it initially being directed more towards the wealthy citizens with land ownership is also important to consider. While sortition aimed to ensure broader participation than pure election, the definition of "citizen" in ancient Athens excluded women, slaves, and resident foreigners, so it wasn't a completely universal system in the way we might conceive of it today.
Despite these limitations, the core principle of random selection was central to Athenian democracy for much of its history. They believed that choosing officials by lot was the most democratic method, as it gave all eligible citizens an equal chance of holding office, regardless of their wealth, social standing, or oratorical skills. Election, on the other hand, was seen as potentially favoring the wealthy and well-known.
As you mentioned, the Athenian system is quite different from the representative democracy we have in many Western countries today. In our system, we vote for a relatively small number of individuals who then make decisions on our behalf. The Athenians, particularly in their radical democratic phase, practiced a more direct form of democracy where a larger body of citizens participated directly in decision-making, with sortition playing a key role in selecting many of the individuals who would serve in various governmental roles.
Your description of our current system as one where "a few people are presented to us by a few people" and those presented often become the "winners" who may act as "puppets" raises a critical question about the true extent of citizen control in modern democracies. The Athenian example of sortition offers a historical counterpoint and a different model for how a society might choose its leaders and involve its citizens in governance.
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